Egyptian Israelite preview video?

[history91]

Here is a guy previewing his video that he will use to try and prove the ancient Egyptians and and ancient Israelites were not black. Since the Bible said they looked a like he has to prove both were not black.

Side note: I'm not down with these Hebrew Israelite camps.

youtu.be/tao_Fb3jlbU

[zarahan]

Sounds like a fake "Heebrew Izralite" frontin.. behind which is some white lamer..
And the Bible says no such thing. Actually the Egyptians- or Mizraim, designated sons
of Ham, is a biological brother with Cush (meaning "black" in Hebrew). And the closest ethnic cousins
of the Egyptians are Nubians, not "Heebrews." So right off the bat the video already registers
as bullshiit..








-----------------------------------------

PER AN OLD ES POST:


Interestingly enough one of the descendants of Mizraim recorded by Moses is Lud or the Ludim, renowned as bowmen.
Jeremiah 46:9- "let the mighty men go forth: Cush and Phut that handle the shield, and the Ludim that handle the bow."

Isa 66:19 also refers to Pul or Put and Lud "that draw the bow."

Notice how Cush, Lud and Phut are all linked together- all related in the Biblical text. Moses, ties all these peoples together- Ham, Cush, Mizraim, Phut, Caanan...


8) Per scholar David Goldenberg 2003 The Curse of Ham:
"In a description of the foreign contingents in the Egyptian army at the battle of Carchemish in 605 B.C.E, Jer 46:9 says: "Let the warriors go forth, Kush and Put who grasp the shield. And the Ludim who grasp and draw the bow.".. However because Lud is grouped with Kush in Jer 46:9 and Ezek 30:5 and because Put, whether it is to be identified with modern Somalia or Libya is in Africa, most scholars today agree that Lud too is in Africa. And just as the bows, so too the shields of the Kushites must have made an impression. Apparently their striking feature was also their size. Similarly Strabo (17.1.54) mentions the Ethiopians' long oblong shields."
--David M. Goldenberg. The Curse of Ham: Race and Slavery in Early Judaism, Christianity, and Islam

9) As Goldenberg shows the Biblical text often groups Cush, Put, Lud etc together.
They are all related- sons of Ham or sons of Mizraim (Egypt).

[history91]

Genesis 50:7-11King James Version (KJV)

7 And Joseph went up to bury his father: and with him went up all the servants of Pharaoh, the elders of his house, and all the elders of the land of Egypt,

8 And all the house of Joseph, and his brethren, and his father's house: only their little ones, and their flocks, and their herds, they left in the land of Goshen.

9 And there went up with him both chariots and horsemen: and it was a very great company.

10 And they came to the threshingfloor of Atad, which is beyond Jordan, and there they mourned with a great and very sore lamentation: and he made a mourning for his father seven days.

11 And when the inhabitants of the land, the Canaanites, saw the mourning in the floor of Atad, they said, This is a grievous mourning to the Egyptians: wherefore the name of it was called Abelmizraim, which is beyond Jordan.

[history91]

“Know that the land of Egypt when the Mussulmans entered it, was full of Christians, but divided amongst themselves in two sects, both AS TO RACE AND RELIGION.
The one part was made up of men about the court and public affairs, all Greek, from among the soldiers of Constantinople, the seat of government of Rum; their views as well as their religion, were all of them Melkite; and their number was above 300 000, all Greeks.
The other portion was the whole people of Egypt, who were Qibt, and were of mixed descent; among whom one could not distinguish Qibt from Abyssinian, Nubian OR ISRAELITE; and they were all Jacobites. Some of them were writers in government offices, others were merchants and tradesmen, others were bishops and presbyters and such like, others were tillers of the land in the country, while others were of the class of servants and domestics. But between these and the Melkite ruling population, marriages were not allowed, from MUTUAL HATRED of each other, often carried to murders on either side.”

Written by Al Maqrizi translated in the book – The Sheikh and Imam Taqi-ed-din El-Maqrizi of Cairo family from Baalbek, History of the Copts and of their Church, published 1873, p. 72.


• Found in Rabbinic Hebrew tradition... the 8th century Pirke De-Rabbi Eliezer (Chapter 23):
Noah brought his sons and his grandsons, and he blessed them with their (several) settlements, and he gave them as an inheritance all the earth. He especially blessed Shem and his sons, black but comely, and he gave them the inhabitable earth. He blessed Ham and his sons, black like a raven, and he gave them as an inheritance the coast of the sea. He blessed Japheth and his sons, they entirely white, and he gave them for an inheritance the desert and its fields; these (are the inheritances with) which he endowed them.[1]

• Al-Tabari (d. 923), the famed Muslim historian and Qur’anic exegete, recorded in his Ta’rikh al-rusul wa’l-muluk (“The History of the Messengers and Kings”) the following on the authority of ‘Abd Allāh b. ‘Abbās, the cousin of the prophet Muhammad of Arabia:

The Children of Sam (Shem) settled in the center of the Earth, which is between Satidma and the sea and between Yemen and Syria. Allah made the prophets from them, revealed the Books to them, made them beautiful, gave them a black complexion, luminous and free of blemish…The children of Ham settled in the south..Allah gave them a black complexion and gave some of them a black complexion, luminous and blemish-free…The children of Japheth settled in Safoun toward the north…They are light-skinned and very fair-skinned.

[anansi]

Yup sounds like klik bait bs to me, but here is the key deception, the BHIs or some of them will separate Negro from Black and call Africans Hamites, thus making two distinct "black races" that hate each other, Negroes being Hebrews and scattered among the Americas,and involve native Americans of whatever shade, so while the vid clip seemed to indicate the Egyptians and Israelites were not Negroes it does not meant they weren't Black.

But taken from a purely religious or biblical perspective from the King James Version of which many tend to rely on instead of the Torah or some other Hebrew work, the claims is also debunked as the Israelites are shown to be repeatedly mixed with so called Hamitic Egyptians and "Nubians", example Moses was Married to an Ethiopian woman,ie Kushite he also married to Kushite Zipporah of Madianite extraction, if following the rules of that society then the bloodline through the females at the very least would make them Hamites, then there is Phinehas a grandson of Aaron who formed the priest hood of Israel, he is non other than a Ta-Nahesi or P3nahs aka Kushite or a so-called "Nubian",Joseph married a Kemitic woman, one Asenath, from that union came the Israelite tribes of Manasseh and Ephraim, so intermixed with was the Hebrew tribes with the so-called Hamities of Africa that one cannot simply pry them apart.

Non biblical sources also agree.
The remains found at Lakish:The excavacation uncovered a mass of human bones,which was estamated to from the remains of fifteen hundred individuals..remains of 695 skulls were brought to London by the British expidition...curiously,the crania indicate a close resemblance to the population of Egypt at this time...the relationships found suggest that the population of the town in 700 B.C was entirely of Egyptian origin..they show further,that the population of lakish was probably derived from upper Egypt.James e Brunson

You guys understand the significance of the above? followed by this statement by Pliny The Elder-Roman Naturalist....

That Syria was once the domain of Cepheus, an Ethiopian king,Tacitus wrote that the Romans believed that the Jews originated in Ethiopia but fled the persecutions of the King. Strabo,even earlier,stressed that people of Western Judea was Africiod:

But although the inhabitants are mixed up thus,the most accredited reports in regards to the people of Jerusalem represents the ancestors of the present Judeans as they are called Egyptians.

Read more: egyptsearchreloaded.proboards.com/thread/83/ancient-hebrews-black#ixzz4QbOKMzjH
Btw kilk^here.

[history91]

Here is the final video proving there was no black Egyptians and Israelites.

Part 5 he gets into the ancient Egyptians not being black.https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=J88_5u6-oRbw

www.youtube.com/shared?ci=J88_5u6-oRbw

[matu]

Nov 20, 2016 15:31:46 GMT -5 history91 said:

“Know that the land of Egypt when the Mussulmans entered it, was full of Christians, but divided amongst themselves in two sects, both AS TO RACE AND RELIGION.
The one part was made up of men about the court and public affairs, all Greek, from among the soldiers of Constantinople, the seat of government of Rum; their views as well as their religion, were all of them Melkite; and their number was above 300 000, all Greeks.
The other portion was the whole people of Egypt, who were Qibt, and were of mixed descent; among whom one could not distinguish Qibt from Abyssinian, Nubian OR ISRAELITE; and they were all Jacobites. Some of them were writers in government offices, others were merchants and tradesmen, others were bishops and presbyters and such like, others were tillers of the land in the country, while others were of the class of servants and domestics. But between these and the Melkite ruling population, marriages were not allowed, from MUTUAL HATRED of each other, often carried to murders on either side.”

Written by Al Maqrizi translated in the book – The Sheikh and Imam Taqi-ed-din El-Maqrizi of Cairo family from Baalbek, History of the Copts and of their Church, published 1873, p. 72.


• Found in Rabbinic Hebrew tradition... the 8th century Pirke De-Rabbi Eliezer (Chapter 23):
Noah brought his sons and his grandsons, and he blessed them with their (several) settlements, and he gave them as an inheritance all the earth. He especially blessed Shem and his sons, black but comely, and he gave them the inhabitable earth. He blessed Ham and his sons, black like a raven, and he gave them as an inheritance the coast of the sea. He blessed Japheth and his sons, they entirely white, and he gave them for an inheritance the desert and its fields; these (are the inheritances with) which he endowed them.[1]

• Al-Tabari (d. 923), the famed Muslim historian and Qur’anic exegete, recorded in his Ta’rikh al-rusul wa’l-muluk (“The History of the Messengers and Kings”) the following on the authority of ‘Abd Allāh b. ‘Abbās, the cousin of the prophet Muhammad of Arabia:

The Children of Sam (Shem) settled in the center of the Earth, which is between Satidma and the sea and between Yemen and Syria. Allah made the prophets from them, revealed the Books to them, made them beautiful, gave them a black complexion, luminous and free of blemish…The children of Ham settled in the south..Allah gave them a black complexion and gave some of them a black complexion, luminous and blemish-free…The children of Japheth settled in Safoun toward the north…They are light-skinned and very fair-skinned.

Hi, any idea where is "Safoun"? Japheth's settlement?
How did Japheth become "white" if his brothers and father was Black?
Do you really believe environmental factors turned Japheth "white" when the indigenous peoples of the poles (Eskimos, Aleutians, etc) remain dark skinned, dark-haired, and dark-eyed to this day?
I'm VERY suspect of Japheth, he was the first born, but got the least inheritance. 
The Book of Jasher and Jubilees attest to this. 
Everyone likes to focus on Ham, but he wasn't the one who Noah cursed -- that was Canaan. As the youngest son, Ham's inheritance far exceeded that of Japheth, who was clearly CURSED. 

[zarahan]

Takuri on ES had an old thread showing traditions that Japheth was dark-skinned.
If a branch of these folk entered cold-climate Europe, eventually over millennia
their skin would get lighter, or if a group with a particular light skinned mutation
became more numerous through accident or other means (genetic drift), then paleness
could occur. Also indigenous peoples of the poles, while not as pale like most of today's
cold-climate pale Europeans, are not as dark-skinned as most tropical peoples either.


Where in the books of Jasher or Jubilee does it talk about Japheth? Can you give
specific quotes with citation?

[matu]

Mar 9, 2018 22:46:12 GMT -5 zarahan said:

Takuri on ES had an old thread showing traditions that Japheth was dark-skinned.
If a branch of these folk entered cold-climate Europe, eventually over millennia
their skin would get lighter, or if a group with a particular light skinned mutation
became more numerous through accident or other means (genetic drift), then paleness
could occur. Also indigenous peoples of the poles, while not as pale like most of today's
cold-climate pale Europeans, are not as dark-skinned as most tropical peoples either.


Where in the books of Jasher or Jubilee does it talk about Japheth? Can you give
specific quotes with citation?

Oh hi, sorry was not notified by email of your response. Anywhoo, I totally agree that Japheth was dark-skinned. Therefore it's a bit confusing why those quotes from arab an ancient hebrew sources indicate something slightly different. 

Japheth and his offspring aren't spoken of too well in the Bible. The Bible is largely silent on his progeny except in prophetic and end-time scriptures. Notice the 4 beasts of Daniel were pretty much all Japheth. 

Let's start with Gen 9:27. Do a careful review of the word "enlarge" in the Hebrew. It doesn't mean 'expand' or 'vast' like you would think. It means something else. Please do your research on that word "enlarge" and it changes the entire meaning of that passage. Please seek out this word, and tell me what you find. 

Furthermore, only ONE SON was blessed in Gen 9:26-27. People think Yah blessed Japheth by "enlarging" him, but he did not. He allowed something else to happen to Japheth, and you'll know exactly what that is by reviewing how that word is used IN THE HEBREW CONCORDANCE.

Next, Cham wasn't a righteous guy for sure. His progeny largely had nephilim blood (ie Canaanites). But even as the youngest son, notice the order he's always listed next to SHEM and Japheth (whose the eldest) is always listed LAST. We must ask ourselves, why didn't Japheth get the blessing of the firstborn when he got the LEAST or THIRD portion (Jub8:25), which were all the miserable and cold climates (Jub 8:29-30). He was even JEALOUS of sneaky CHAM (Jub 7:15) and begged his brother Shem (Arphaxad) to dwell in his land b/c his own inheritance displeased him (Jub 10:35). This should give further insight on Japheth's character and that of his offspring. 

Last, there is a Dead Sea Scrolls book, called "The War Scrolls" and it tells you the nations that will fight Yahshua Hamashiach upon his return. Guess which son of Noach is the father of all those nations? lololol.....

[Tukuler al~Takruri]

Just a reminder.
Japheth is derived from the Hebrew for fair,bright.

Per De Pirqe Ribbi Eli`ezer
Shem was blessed black and beautiful
Hham was blessed black like the raven
Yafet was blessed white all over.

Noah was the first white skinned human
and because he was born white at first
his mom and dad were afraid of him.


Were it not for Judaism, Christianity, and
Islam, this would just myth and legend like
Hesiod's Theogony, once taken as religion,
instead
of like the Hindu Rg Veda affecting whole
peoples' daily interactions.

Apr 25, 2018 16:48:07 GMT -5 matu said:

Mar 9, 2018 22:46:12 GMT -5 zarahan said:

Takuri on ES had an old thread showing traditions that Japheth was dark-skinned.
If a branch of these folk entered cold-climate Europe, eventually over millennia
their skin would get lighter, or if a group with a particular light skinned mutation
became more numerous through accident or other means (genetic drift), then paleness
could occur. Also indigenous peoples of the poles, while not as pale like most of today's
cold-climate pale Europeans, are not as dark-skinned as most tropical peoples either.


Where in the books of Jasher or Jubilee does it talk about Japheth? Can you give
specific quotes with citation?

Oh hi, sorry was not notified by email of your response. Anywhoo, I totally agree that Japheth was dark-skinned. Therefore it's a bit confusing why those quotes from arab an ancient hebrew sources indicate something slightly different. 

Japheth and his offspring aren't spoken of too well in the Bible. The Bible is largely silent on his progeny except in prophetic and end-time scriptures. Notice the 4 beasts of Daniel were pretty much all Japheth. 

Let's start with Gen 9:27. Do a careful review of the word "enlarge" in the Hebrew. It doesn't mean 'expand' or 'vast' like you would think. It means something else. Please do your research on that word "enlarge" and it changes the entire meaning of that passage. Please seek out this word, and tell me what you find. 

Furthermore, only ONE SON was blessed in Gen 9:26-27. People think Yah blessed Japheth by "enlarging" him, but he did not. He allowed something else to happen to Japheth, and you'll know exactly what that is by reviewing how that word is used IN THE HEBREW CONCORDANCE.

Next, Cham wasn't a righteous guy for sure. His progeny largely had nephilim blood (ie Canaanites). But even as the youngest son, notice the order he's always listed next to SHEM and Japheth (whose the eldest) is always listed LAST. We must ask ourselves, why didn't Japheth get the blessing of the firstborn when he got the LEAST or THIRD portion (Jub8:25), which were all the miserable and cold climates (Jub 8:29-30). He was even JEALOUS of sneaky CHAM (Jub 7:15) and begged his brother Shem (Arphaxad) to dwell in his land b/c his own inheritance displeased him (Jub 10:35). This should give further insight on Japheth's character and that of his offspring. 

Last, there is a Dead Sea Scrolls book, called "The War Scrolls" and it tells you the nations that will fight Yahshua Hamashiach upon his return. Guess which son of Noach is the father of all those nations? lololol.....

[zarahan]

Matu says:
Let's start with Gen 9:27. Do a careful review of the word "enlarge" in the Hebrew. It doesn't mean 'expand' or 'vast' like you would think. It means something else. Please do your research on that word "enlarge" and it changes the entire meaning of that passage. Please seek out this word, and tell me what you find.

Furthermore, only ONE SON was blessed in Gen 9:26-27. People think Yah blessed Japheth by "enlarging" him, but he did not. He allowed something else to happen to Japheth, and you'll know exactly what that is by reviewing how that word is used IN THE HEBREW CONCORDANCE.

Next, Cham wasn't a righteous guy for sure. His progeny largely had nephilim blood (ie Canaanites). But even as the youngest son, notice the order he's always listed next to SHEM and Japheth (whose the eldest) is always listed LAST. We must ask ourselves, why didn't Japheth get the blessing of the firstborn when he got the LEAST or THIRD portion (Jub8:25), which were all the miserable and cold climates (Jub 8:29-30). He was even JEALOUS of sneaky CHAM (Jub 7:15) and begged his brother Shem (Arphaxad) to dwell in his land b/c his own inheritance displeased him (Jub 10:35). This should give further insight on Japheth's character and that of his offspring.

Last, there is a Dead Sea Scrolls book, called "The War Scrolls" and it tells you the nations that will fight Yahshua Hamashiach upon his return. Guess which son of Noach is the father of all those nations? lololol.....

OK, You say do research on the word 'enlarge' but you yourself have not put any on the table as yet.
If it doesn't mean enlarge or expand, what does it mean, and what credible scholars do you
cite as to the alternative meaning? Give some specifics, and good references. What are
the details?

And what else happened to Japheth? You give no specifics just claim such and such. Exactly
what happened, and what is the source and reference citation to this HEbrew concordance?
Surely you should be able to give some specifics after having made so clear a claim.
A concordance would more focus on word meanings, not on explaining historical events.

And how is Nephilin, Canaanite blood? According to whom and when? Again you give no specifics
and no credible citation (I dont mean a youtube video) but credible reference. What
are the specifics?

On the War Scrolls you say it tells of battles against nations in the final days. OK I can go
with this point, and indeed it is nothing new, for the Bible (Exekiel 38) tells of the same
climatic conflict against Gog, Magog and assorted nations. These have long been recognized
by Hebrew and Christian scholars as including the northern zone "Japhetic" nations. Point taken,
BUT, this has nothing to do with the issues re the word "enlarge" above.

What you say above might be perfectly correct, but can you post some more specifics,
and credible references backing up various claims?

[zarahan]

al Takruri said:
Just a reminder.
Japheth is derived from the Hebrew for fair,bright.

Per De Pirqe Ribbi Eli`ezer
Shem was blessed black and beautiful
Hham was blessed black like the raven
Yafet was blessed white all over.

Noah was the first white skinned human
and because he was born white at first
his mom and dad were afraid of him.


Were it not for Judaism, Christianity, and
Islam, this would just myth and legend like
Hesiod's Theogony, once taken as religion,
instead
of like the Hindu Rg Veda affecting whole
peoples' daily interactions.

Can you give a citation to this Rabbi above? I am skeptical as to his take.
Most Biblical scholars, including the Jewish ones, hold that Japhet means "enlarge."
Golderberg 's book - The CUrse of Ham mentioned above, gives several citations.

And the Biblical text and other in-depth interpretations do not say Noah was white.
This sounds like a later add-on by some Jewish, Arab and EUropean writers- which seems as
as equally shaky as their claim of a so-called "Curse of Ham" - a curse that appears
nowhere in the Hebrew Bible, or in any credible ancient manuscript of the writings of Moses.
Interpretations by somebody, someplace, yes,but as to the original or close to the earliest
writings, doubtful.


I have no doubt you are correct that some Rabbi, somewhere out there, said such
but the notion Noah's mom and Dad being afraid of his whiteness and so on, sounds like a
"racial" fable tacked-on later, and inconsistent with Moses writings, which in general,
based on the info he had at the time, depicts Africans or "blacks" fairly, and credits them
with the first great civilizations. I cant say the same for some later Jewish, Arab and Christian
writers, always trying to run black folk down.

[Tukuler al~Takruri]

Forgive me but I'm kinda tired of this
after presenting it many times so I'll
just link
www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=008473
sorry.


Also sorry I shot from the hip not the
lexicon. Thanks for precisioning me.

Yefeth is not from the root yafah bright beautiful fair
Yefeth is from the hiphil of the root pathah spread-open deceive

Gesenius Hebrew and English Lexicon
Jastrow Dictionary targum talmud midrash


Israelites have more than the Torah. The
Miqr'aoth Gedoloth compendium has
the early great commentaries on Torah.

There are books of aggada and midrash
that inform the schooled Jew on what
canon leaves unmentioned. Besides the
well respected Pirqe pseudonymously
written by Ribbi Eli`ezer ben Hyrcanus
• Midrash Rabba
• Yalkut Me'am Lo`ez
• Tz'enah u R'enah
And for the Jew without schooling
• Ginzberg Legends of the Jews
• Patai Hebrew Myths


EDIT

Jewish Encyclopedia said:

JAPHETH (יֶפֶת).

By: Emil G. Hirsch, M. Seligsohn, Solomon Schechter

—Biblical Data:
The name "Japheth" is derived, according to Gen. ix. 27, from the Aramaic root פַתֶּה = "to extend," in allusion to the expansion of the Japhetites. Saadia and the modern lexicographers, as Gesenius and others, derive it from יָפֶה = "fair"; but this interpretation had already been rejected by Ibn Ezra.


—In Rabbinical Literature:
"yaft elohim le-Yefet" (Gen. ix. 27) are interpreted as alluding to the construction of the Second Temple by Cyrus, who was descended from Japheth (Yoma 10a). Bar Ḳappara interpreted the passage as meaning that the Law will be explained in the language of Japheth (Gen. R. xxxvi.; Deut. R. i.); R. Ḥiyya b. Abba, interpreting "yaft" as derived from the root יָפֶה, meaning "beauty" (see Japheth, Biblical Data), explains it more clearly thus: "The Law will be explained in the beautiful language of the Greeks, descendants of Japheth" (Meg. 9b).


When God blessed Noah and his sons (Gen. ix. 1), He in blessing Japheth promised that all of his sons should be white; and He gave them as their portion deserts and fields (Pirḳe R. El. xxiv.).

[zarahan]

OK, thanks. Just looking for the cite. You are correct. SO it indeed seems that there
are a number of interpretations as to Japheth. Per the Jewish Encyclopedia you give above
there is the 'enlargement' interpretation held by Jewish scholars, and this is a general
holding for many as to the Bible, though as noted, some hold for the 'fair' line..


"The name "Japheth" is derived, according to Gen. ix. 27, from the Aramaic root = "to extend," in allusion to the expansion of the Japhetites. Saadia and the modern lexicographers, as Gesenius and others, derive it from = "fair"; but this interpretation had already been rejected by Ibn Ezra."


I believe you have done a service over the years by pointing out (and documenting using Jewish sources)
that "Shem" can also be held to denote "dark" or "black."

There are a number of theological and social construct debates as to this that fills shelves
but no doubt, these "SHem" people, seen in modern European and American racial constructs, that various
right wingers assert as valid- using their own constructs- these people would have been routed
to the back of the bus, lynched or ethnically cleansed in various places, or discriminated against ir
"profiled" in law enforcement, housing, employment, etc etc in the modern era.

The Biblical narrative of course is concerned with the moral and spiritual aspects not "racial," so Shem could
be very dark-skinned without affecting these core concerns. He could be as black as Anwar Sadat, or black American
actor Lou Gossett who is about same skin color as Sadat, who took much criticism from allegedly more "enlightened"
modern Arabized Egyptians (he was "too black" per some) for portraying Sadat in the 1980s.



Looking more at some of the website you reference, a roundup of locations includes:

The Sons of Japheth.
Biblical. Rabbinical comparison
--------- ---------------------
Gomer. Carthagena (; according to some sources, Gothia).
Magog. Germania.
Madai. Media.
Javan. Macedonia (according to some sources, Ephesus).
Tubal. Bithynia.
Meshech. Mysia.
Tiras. Thracia.
The Sons of Gomer.
Ashkenaz. Asia (preconsuiaris).
Riphath. Adiabene.
Togarmah. Germanicia (city in the province of Commagene).
The Sons of Javan.
Elishah. Æolis (in Asia Minor).
Tarshish. Tarsus (city in Asia Minor).
Kittim. Italy (southern; according to some sources, Hellas).
Dodanim. Dardania (a district in the southwestern part of Mœsia).
-----------------------------------------------

The Sons of Ham.
Cush. Arabia.
Mizraim. Egypt.
Phut. Marmarica (between Egypt and Cyrenaica).
Canaan. Canaan.
The Sons of Cush and Raamah.
Seba. Syene (the frontier town of Egypt to the south).
Havilah. India (in Africa, south of Egypt).
Sabtah. Lembritæ (to the south of Meroë).
Raamah. Libya (between Egypt and Ethiopia).
Sabtecah. Region on the eastern coast of Africa.
Sheba. Mons Samaragdus (along the Red Sea).
Dedan. Mazaces (in Mauritania).
Nimrod's Kingdom and His Foundations.
Frech. Warka (on the left bank of the Euphrates; according to some sources, Charon in Media).
Accad. Cascara (on the Tigris; according to some sources, Nisibin).
Caineh. Nippur (unidentified by the Midrash; according to some sources, Ctesiphon).
Rehobot. Probably a suburb of Nineveh.
Calah. Edessa.
Rosen. Ctesiphon.
The Sons of Mizraim.
Ludim. Nomos Neut.
Anamim. Mareotæ.
Lohabim. Nomos in North Egypt.
Naphtuhim. Pentascoimen.
Pathrusim. Unidentified.
Casluhim. Pentapolis (Cyrenaica).
Caphtorim. Cappadocia.

-----------------------------------------------
--FROM: JEWISH ENCYCLOPEDIA
www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11382-nations-and-languages-the-seventy



^^The only problem I have with the Rabbinical interpretations above is that Cush in the Biblical
narrative while including Arabia and Babylon area SOMETIMES, ALSO heavily references "Cush" to
the south of Egypt. Nubia/Sudan is a valid Biblical locational reference in its own right, and is not
incompatible with Cushite crossovers to Palestine/Arabia. This makes sense for interchange across
the Red Sea down to the Horn of Africa from Yemen and Arabia is a long-standing thing- so "Cush"
in the Sudan, and "Cush" in Arabia are not mutually exclusive concepts or peoples, as some try to make out.
All these people are interrelated at various levels- "sons of Ham" - so to speak.

When Jeremiah asks "Can the leopard change his spots, or the Cushite [Ethiopian] his skin?" among many other
references to the Sudanic peoples, it means that these people can't be "whited out" of the Biblical narrative.
Indeed it was the Cushites that came to the aid of the Hebrews to save Jerusalem at one time.




Just throwing in some background for the new readers- we had a bit of such over at ES.
Anyway, in various Biblical narratives the severest divine judgements fall on the Japhethic nations.
The massive slaughter to come of the cold-climate zone hordes of Gog and Magog in the Valley of
Decision prophesied by Ezekiel and others is one example. Likewise in the Book of Revelation
the severest heavenly plagues and judgements fall on the area that brings forth the anti-christ,
which would be the Western nations area. But that's another take that fills additional shelves.
Too much for this thread..

[matu]

May 1, 2018 16:04:32 GMT -5 zarahan said:

Matu says:
Let's start with Gen 9:27. Do a careful review of the word "enlarge" in the Hebrew. It doesn't mean 'expand' or 'vast' like you would think. It means something else. Please do your research on that word "enlarge" and it changes the entire meaning of that passage. Please seek out this word, and tell me what you find.

Furthermore, only ONE SON was blessed in Gen 9:26-27. People think Yah blessed Japheth by "enlarging" him, but he did not. He allowed something else to happen to Japheth, and you'll know exactly what that is by reviewing how that word is used IN THE HEBREW CONCORDANCE.

Next, Cham wasn't a righteous guy for sure. His progeny largely had nephilim blood (ie Canaanites). But even as the youngest son, notice the order he's always listed next to SHEM and Japheth (whose the eldest) is always listed LAST. We must ask ourselves, why didn't Japheth get the blessing of the firstborn when he got the LEAST or THIRD portion (Jub8:25), which were all the miserable and cold climates (Jub 8:29-30). He was even JEALOUS of sneaky CHAM (Jub 7:15) and begged his brother Shem (Arphaxad) to dwell in his land b/c his own inheritance displeased him (Jub 10:35). This should give further insight on Japheth's character and that of his offspring.

Last, there is a Dead Sea Scrolls book, called "The War Scrolls" and it tells you the nations that will fight Yahshua Hamashiach upon his return. Guess which son of Noach is the father of all those nations? lololol.....

OK, You say do research on the word 'enlarge' but you yourself have not put any on the table as yet.
If it doesn't mean enlarge or expand, what does it mean, and what credible scholars do you
cite as to the alternative meaning? Give some specifics, and good references. What are
the details?

And what else happened to Japheth? You give no specifics just claim such and such. Exactly
what happened, and what is the source and reference citation to this HEbrew concordance?
Surely you should be able to give some specifics after having made so clear a claim.
A concordance would more focus on word meanings, not on explaining historical events.

And how is Nephilin, Canaanite blood? According to whom and when? Again you give no specifics
and no credible citation (I dont mean a youtube video) but credible reference. What
are the specifics?

On the War Scrolls you say it tells of battles against nations in the final days. OK I can go
with this point, and indeed it is nothing new, for the Bible (Exekiel 38) tells of the same
climatic conflict against Gog, Magog and assorted nations. These have long been recognized
by Hebrew and Christian scholars as including the northern zone "Japhetic" nations. Point taken,
BUT, this has nothing to do with the issues re the word "enlarge" above.

What you say above might be perfectly correct, but can you post some more specifics,
and credible references backing up various claims?

1. "Enlarge" in the context of Gen 9:27 means "deceived". 
www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H6601&t=KJV


2. I've given specifics. I've provided Book, Chapter and Verse as evidence that Japheth got the least blessing though he was the firstborn. 


3. The Bible is replete with references that several of the Canaanite tribes were giants aka nephilim (Num 13:32). I've only provided one verse, but feel free to read corresponding precepts on a Bible site. 


4. The War Scrolls depicts the Battle of Armageddon in the Book of Joel (Gog and Magog takes place after the 1000-year millennial reign, read Revelation 20). Again, virtually all the nations to battle Yahshua comprise of Japheth. He's been "deceived" in every sense of the word to believe he's superior, even to the coming Black Hamashiach