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Post by truth on Apr 5, 2010 16:31:38 GMT -5
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Post by globalafrikanpower on Apr 5, 2010 16:38:46 GMT -5
The Neferiti bust is a forgery, besides Keita warns us not to depend on artwork to tell the race of the ancient Egyptians.
The Geographical Origins and Population Relationships of Early Ancient Egyptians Professor S.O.Y. Keita Department of Biological Anthropology Oxford University
Professor A. J. Boyce University Reader in Human Population
Art objects are not generally used by biological anthropologists. They are suspect as data and their interpretation highly dependent on stereotyped thinking. However, because art has often been used to comment on the physiognomies of ancient Egyptians, a few remarks are in order. A review of literature and the sculpture indicates characteristics that also can be found in the Horn of (East) Africa (see, e.g., Petrie 1939; Drake 1987; Keita 1993). Old and Middle Kingdom statuary shows a range of characteristics; many, if not most, individuals depicted in the art have variations on the narrow-nosed, narrow-faced morphology also seen in various East Africans. This East African anatomy, once seen as being the result of a mixture of different "races," is better understood as being part of the range of indigenous African variation.
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Post by truth on Apr 5, 2010 16:47:54 GMT -5
^out of curiousity, did you post this same info. in the pro-black egypt threads, w/all those nubian egyptian artwork?
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Post by truth on Apr 5, 2010 16:59:28 GMT -5
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Post by sttigray on Apr 6, 2010 19:47:37 GMT -5
Waaay to easy to refute.
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jari
Scribe
Posts: 289
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Post by jari on Apr 7, 2010 8:19:29 GMT -5
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Post by khunanup on Apr 27, 2010 8:19:22 GMT -5
I am sure most realize the following people are a bad cross section of how the typical modern Egyptian looks. Although I will not deny such phenotype exists in modern Egypt, people often exagerate its existenence. In the process they try to erase the typical light to dark brown Egyptian. Alot of those presented are part of the elite and donot represent the typical Egyptian.
Sorry if these videos offend but they are the typical Egyptians.
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Post by anansi on Apr 27, 2010 9:57:11 GMT -5
I am sure most realize the following people are a bad cross section of how the typical modern Egyptian looks. Although I will not deny such phenotype exists in modern Egypt, people often exagerate its existenence. In the process they try to erase the typical light to dark brown Egyptian. Alot of those presented are part of the elite and donot represent the typical Egyptian. Sorry if these videos offend but they are the typical Egyptians. The same scene can be seen right across the globe and not to be funny or anything but while we ponder the faces of the Pharaohs and glorify their achievements we ignore their living descendants living in squalor.
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Post by truthteacher2007 on Apr 28, 2010 8:42:17 GMT -5
I am sure most realize the following people are a bad cross section of how the typical modern Egyptian looks. Although I will not deny such phenotype exists in modern Egypt, people often exagerate its existenence. In the process they try to erase the typical light to dark brown Egyptian. Alot of those presented are part of the elite and donot represent the typical Egyptian. Sorry if these videos offend but they are the typical Egyptians. The same scene can be seen right across the globe and not to be funny or anything but while we ponder the faces of the Pharaohs and glorify their achievements we ignore their living descendants living in squalor. Well damn it its about time SOMEBODY said it. When it all boils down we are talking about people, not laboratory specimines. Being a Jamaican, I know what it is to grow up in a tourist country and see tourists flitting here and there while treating the locals like they're obstacles blocking their views of the attractions. All that money pouring into the country, but somehow, never enough to trickle down to the majority of the people living in desperation. I avoid going to the pyramids like the plague if I can. Loads of tourists trying to connect with the "power of the Pyramids", waxing on an on about how spiritual the place is, but somehow missing the fact that right at the base of the Pyramids is a retched ghetto, actually, its below ghetto, ITS A SLUM! People who can't afford the price of bread, who struggle by on one meal of beans a day. How come none of that spiritual power can roll down the hill to help those people? We sit here debating about how dark or light they are, which to my mind is a very Eurocentric wold view. These people do not relate to each other on those terms and you can't cherry pick. The dark guy who looks like a Somali has borthers and sisters who are light brown. The woman with the pink skin is married to the man with chocolate colored skin. The man with the ruddy complexion has a mother with brown skin and kinky locks down her back and the white guy with the hazel eyes has an afro. How do ypou put people like this in any box? How can you surgically cut them apart and decide what goes where? So what? Should we apply the one drop rule? Well lets all step back and ask ourselves who decided that one drop of "black" makes you all black and why they did it. And while we're on that tio, lets take a look at those videos again and ask ourselves 50 years ago in the South, would those children be going to the "white" school or the "negro" school?
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Post by homeylu on Apr 28, 2010 8:54:01 GMT -5
^^ Lol, Truthteacher2007, sounds like the same litmus test I use when describing the Egyptians, which section of the bus would they be seated in the Jim Crow south, the front or the back? And that's enough to relate them to AA, everything else is debatable, this is not.
You are correct that Egyptians like other Africans use color literally not as a race. A native Egyptian could identify themselves as asmar or samara, which denote different complexions, something like how we use the words brown-skinned or light-skinned, although we are speaking about the same ethnic group of AA and not an entirely different race of people, since race only exists in a social context.
Actually they don't even realize that they are a race until they move to America-the land of races, lol.
Do you know if it's true, that Caucasian is only used in America to describe Europeans. I know a few actual Euros, not the ones descended from immigrants to America, that claim this term is not used in Europe at all. They say people are identified according to their origins, i.e. Italian, French, Russian, etc., and that I would simply be identified as American, since the term African American is not common in their country.
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Post by truthteacher2007 on Apr 28, 2010 8:58:00 GMT -5
Now... A splitting image of his ancestors, ancient Egyptians.The pheonotype is a give-a-way."You see me, you see the ancestor."I'd just like to point out that this is a perfect example of cherry picking. Yes, these are all Egyptians. The young guy has features that identify him as Egyptian, or as me and my friends say, he's been hit with the Egyptian stick real hard. Those features are not Arab, they are East African. Its the shape of the eyes and something you see all the way down the East African coast from Egypt to Somalia and beyond. Its not just skin color. Also look at his physical structure, very long limbs and thin torso. However, having said that, I'd like to point out that the truth is that there is not, nor has there ever been one specific phenotype that is representative of the entire population. So yess while those lighter skinned people are part of the spectrum found there, so are people of the darker end of the spectrum and they represent at least half, if not slightly more of the population. And no, not every dark person you see in Egypt is a Nubian or of Sudanese origin. Attachments:
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Post by homeylu on Apr 28, 2010 9:07:47 GMT -5
I like this photo Truthteacher, because I know one of them is you , but if you posted it on Mathilda's blog, I best they would incorrectly guess which one of these dudes is NOT Egyptian.
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Post by truthteacher2007 on Apr 28, 2010 9:22:52 GMT -5
^^ Lol, Truthteacher2007, sounds like the same litmus test I use when describing the Egyptians, which section of the bus would they be seated in the Jim Crow south, the front or the back? And that's enough to relate them to AA, everything else is debatable, this is not. You are correct that Egyptians like other Africans use color literally not as a race. A native Egyptian could identify themselves as asmar or samara, which denote different complexions, something like how we use the words brown-skinned or light-skinned, although we are speaking about the same ethnic group of AA and not an entirely different race of people, since race only exists in a social context. Actually they don't even realize that they are a race until they move to America-the land of races, lol. Do you know if it's true, that Caucasian is only used in America to describe Europeans. I know a few actual Euros, not the ones descended from immigrants to America, that claim this term is not used in Europe at all. They say people are identified according to their origins, i.e. Italian, French, Russian, etc., and that I would simply be identified as American, since the term African American is not common in their country. Exactly! This whole question of their race is an issue simply for the fact that it flies in the face of the colonialist slave society class structure created to justify slavery and colonialism 500 years ago. Its their attempt to put some sort of meaning to the superficail differences between human populations in order to justify their greed and cruelty. Why are you treating people so inhumanely? Well..... its because they're not really human like we are that's why..... So how do you justify brutalizing people all over the planet? Well.... don't you see they look different? Only people like us are worthy of being treated humanely because we alone are truely human and civilized. So when you get a civilization like Egypt, you have to scrounge around to make them fit that world view. Well..... we are CAUCASIANS and they are CAUCASIANS, therefore, they don't belong to that group, but this one. Its all mind games. On paper they call them caucasians, but in real life, they get the ni$$er treatment. What's that you may ask? Do they live in abject poverty? Are they economically exploited? Do we sell them our out dated medications at inflated prices? Did we colonize their country and impose systems of segragation on them at that time? That's the n$$er treatment. Its no accident that Egypt is dirt poor or that they are so politically and socially confused they don't know if they're coming or going. At the end of the day they are seen and treated as non whites, no matter how much they are twisted and turned to fit a Eurocentric world view on paper. This whole race business and the need to put people into groups is born out of a Eurocentric world view that tries to dictate who should be related to whom based on certain physical criteria. Thing is in the real world, no such bounderies exist. People relate to each other by degree of familiarity, blood line, nationality, religion and culture. These are things that cut across European constructed concepts like race. The White skinned Egyptian identifies with the black skinned Egyptian 1,0000.00 times more than he does with the European of the same color as he, or her. That is the reality. It was true in Ancient times, its true today and is true all over Africa. So my question is as people of the African origin, why do we continue to view our world and our place in it through a Eurocentric lense?
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Post by djoser-xyyman on Apr 28, 2010 9:45:07 GMT -5
^^ who is this guy. . .Doug or MOM. Well written. ^^ Lol, Truthteacher2007, sounds like the same litmus test I use when describing the Egyptians, which section of the bus would they be seated in the Jim Crow south, the front or the back? And that's enough to relate them to AA, everything else is debatable, this is not. You are correct that Egyptians like other Africans use color literally not as a race. A native Egyptian could identify themselves as asmar or samara, which denote different complexions, something like how we use the words brown-skinned or light-skinned, although we are speaking about the same ethnic group of AA and not an entirely different race of people, since race only exists in a social context. Actually they don't even realize that they are a race until they move to America-the land of races, lol. Do you know if it's true, that Caucasian is only used in America to describe Europeans. I know a few actual Euros, not the ones descended from immigrants to America, that claim this term is not used in Europe at all. They say people are identified according to their origins, i.e. Italian, French, Russian, etc., and that I would simply be identified as American, since the term African American is not common in their country. Exactly! This whole question of their race is an issue simply for the fact that it flies in the face of the colonialist slave society class structure created to justify slavery and colonialism 500 years ago. Its their attempt to put some sort of meaning to the superficail differences between human populations in order to justify their greed and cruelty. Why are you treating people so inhumanely? Well..... its because they're not really human like we are that's why..... So how do you justify brutalizing people all over the planet? Well.... don't you see they look different? Only people like us are worthy of being treated humanely because we alone are truely human and civilized. So when you get a civilization like Egypt, you have to scrounge around to make them fit that world view. Well..... we are CAUCASIANS and they are CAUCASIANS, therefore, they don't belong to that group, but this one. Its all mind games. On paper they call them caucasians, but in real life, they get the ni$$er treatment. What's that you may ask? Do they live in abject poverty? Are they economically exploited? Do we sell them our out dated medications at inflated prices? Did we colonize their country and impose systems of segragation on them at that time? That's the n$$er treatment. Its no accident that Egypt is dirt poor or that they are so politically and socially confused they don't know if they're coming or going. At the end of the day they are seen and treated as non whites, no matter how much they are twisted and turned to fit a Eurocentric world view on paper. This whole race business and the need to put people into groups is born out of a Eurocentric world view that tries to dictate who should be related to whom based on certain physical criteria. Thing is in the real world, no such bounderies exist. People relate to each other by degree of familiarity, blood line, nationality, religion and culture. These are things that cut across European constructed concepts like race. The White skinned Egyptian identifies with the black skinned Egyptian 1,0000.00 times more than he does with the European of the same color as he, or her. That is the reality. It was true in Ancient times, its true today and is true all over Africa. So my question is as people of the African origin, why do we continue to view our world and our place in it through a Eurocentric lense?
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Post by homeylu on Apr 29, 2010 5:42:12 GMT -5
^^ who is this guy. . .Doug or MOM. Well written. LOL, neither. Another independent thinker that was not a former member of the ES crew. BTW, we're showing up in the google search engines now.
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