AFRICAN STEEL MAKING

[Charlie Bass]

www.uh.edu/engines/epi385.htm

[anansi]

I am trying to find it ,but there was an African steel trade to Asia especially to India and Damascus where it became famously known as Damascus steel. the technique of people like the Haya may have well been employed.

[franklin]

Many European industries actually developed as a way of competing with African industries. Basil Davidson wrote something about African steel or something like that in east Africa being competitive even in the 19th century but as the article shows African steel producers lost out to European steel in the end

This is interesting but it says the Zanj have no boats and that Indian steel is famous, Idrisi is supposed to be important when it comes to talking about the steel trade:

Al Idrisi (1150) (Kitab Ruyar) written in Sicily

sites.google.com/site/historyofeastafrica/al-idrisi

[The Zanj have no ships in which they can voyage, but boats land in their country from Oman, as do others that are going to Zabaj (or Djawaga) (Endonezya). These foreigners sell their goods there, and buy the produce of the country. The inhabitants of Zabaj (or Djawaga) call at Zanj in both large and small ships (zawariq wa marakib kubar) and trade their merchandise with them, as they understand each other's language. The Zendj have at the bottom of their hearts a great respect for the Arabs. For this reason, when they see an Arab, whether a traveler or merchants they prostrate themselves before him. They say in their language: Welcome son of Yemen. The visitors to this country steal their children, enticing them away by means of giving them fruit. They carry the children from place to place and finally take possession of them and carry them off to their own country. Because the people of Zangibar or numerous and are short on food. The ruler from the island of Qais (or Keish) in the sea of Oman (opposite Muscat, the port that became important after the decline of Siraf) had 505 ships with which he used to raid the Zanj coast for slaves and he makes many captives....

....This section embraces the description of the remainder of the country of Sofala
You first find two towns or better two big villages, in-between there are villages and camps that resemble those of the Arabs. Those big villages are called Djantama and Dandama (Chindi and Quilimane?) They are situated at the sea shore and rather small. The inhabitants are poor, miserable, and without resources to support them except iron, of this metal there are numerous mines in the mountains of Sofala. People of the Zabag (or Zanedj or Raneh) come hither for iron, which they carry to the continent and islands of India where they sell it for good money, because it is an object of big trade and it has a huge market in India. For although there is good quality iron in the islands and in the mines of that country, it does not equal the iron of Sofala for its quality and its malleability.The Indians are masters in the arts of working it. They prepare and mix the substances so that through fusion one gets the soft steel normally called: India steel. They have factories that make the best swords in the world. This is how in iron Sind, Serenbid and Yemen rival among each other in quality through local circumstances, as well as the art of manufacturing, the pouring of the steel, the smelting, and the beauty of the polished surface. But nothing cuts better then this iron from India. Everybody knows that and nobody can deny it.]

[sundiata]

^^You exclusively rely too much on dated Arabic sources. Felix Chami (or anyone else for that matter who has actually studied the region) would clearly disagree with this.

www.cleveland.com/travel/index.ssf/2008/03/zanzibar_a_faraway_island_of_s.html

Quote: "an account of Indian Ocean commerce written by an anonymous sailor in the first century A.D.: "Two days sail beyond, there lies the very last market town of the continent of Azania, which is called Rhapta, which has its name from the sewed boats already mentioned; in which there is ivory in great quantity and tortoise-shell. Along this coast live men of piratical habits, very great in stature."

Rhapta is not seen on any Stone Town signpost today. But Felix Chami, an archaeologist who has explored relics of ancient trade on the island, is convinced. "This [description] cannot be any other than Zanzibar," he contends.

"We know there was trade from very early days," he said, speaking to our group a few days earlier in a classroom dimmed by a power outage at the University of Dar es Salaam. "The first hard evidence comes from the first century Periplus."

The sewn boats are still around. Graceful sails of the wooden dhows ply the waters near the Forodhani Gardens, past the breakfast tables of the Serena Inn, crewed by modern-day sailors looking for fish and tourists. "
................

In any event, not to veer off topic, the steel produced by early Tanzanians as early as the 2nd century, was clearly superior to anything Europe had produced until the industrial age. Have you guys ever seen the "Africans in Science" lecture by Ivan Van Sertima? He discusses these findings in detail..

video.google.com/videoplay?docid=646422939488958030#

[franklin]

Actually I was actually thinking I should make more use of Arabic sources, which is why I brought up Al Idrisi who is known as being an important source source when it comes to this iron trade.

Anyway my comment didn't say I was relying on him exclusively as I mentioned the 19th century

[franklin]

Apr 21, 2010 21:33:13 GMT -5 franklin said:

Many European industries actually developed as a way of competing with African industries. Basil Davidson wrote something about African steel or something like that in east Africa being competitive even in the 19th century but as the article shows African steel producers lost out to European steel in the end

This is interesting but it says the Zanj have no boats and that Indian steel is famous, Idrisi is supposed to be important when it comes to talking about the steel trade:

There is nothing in my comment in itself to disagree with, I myself have been saying Africans were the greatest navigators in the world, and most of what I said was not relying on Arab sources. I do not understand why you said I rely exclusively on Arab sources

[sundiata]

^Well excuse me then if I may have misinterpreted your post. I was under the impression that you supported this isolated description of Zanj (basically the Swahili) having no boats. I guess that I was confused as to your reason for citing him.

[franklin]

Because he is an important source concerning steel and I'm hoping people start looking more into Arabic sources

Edit: I was also wondering about translations too because he is said to be important by some people