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Post by anansi on Jan 31, 2014 16:03:29 GMT -5
Azrur the pic is from the artist imagination, as regards the actual skin color understand that the above falls well within the range of modern Europeans,he was more likely much much darker than the above,spamming pics of modern Greeks who are some what swarthy does not help,pls read the study carefully.
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Post by zarahan on Feb 1, 2014 22:35:04 GMT -5
if you look at the video it talk about that and it says other of these genetics DNA study contradict this one what are we to make of this? who is right who is wrong? how do we tell?There is no real contradiction. The HLA studies never make the strawman argument that ALL Greeks have African DNA, just a percentage of them, in certain locations sampled. Few people disputes Greeks are mostly European, but the HLA analysis indicates that they have certain levels of admixture with Africans, and not just on HLA. Greeks are related to Africans via cystic fibrosis mutations for example. This does not mean Greeks "come from Africa" as various bogus strawmen allege, but that there is a level of admixture that can be detected.
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Post by zarahan on Feb 1, 2014 22:42:29 GMT -5
the pic is from the artist imagination, as regards the actual skin color understand that the above falls well within the range of modern Europeans,he was more likely much much darker than the above
Indeed, possibly quite dark-skinned.
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Post by truthteacher2007 on Feb 2, 2014 10:31:07 GMT -5
the pic is from the artist imagination, as regards the actual skin color understand that the above falls well within the range of modern Europeans,he was more likely much much darker than the above
Indeed, possibly quite dark-skinned. Africans had been in Greece since antiquity as can be atested from the numerous accounts and epictions of them. However, a lot of Africans probably found their way into Greece during the Ottoman Empire. Until the early 20th century a significant portion of the Greek world extended westward into Anatolia. Under the Ottoman Turks a lot of Africans were brought to Turkey and its territories. A considerable percetace of them were absorbed into the population. Today, one can still see the descendants of these people in Modern Turkey. This video speaks to the African presence in Cyprus and mentions that there were similar communities in Creete as well.
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Post by zarahan on Feb 2, 2014 13:27:26 GMT -5
Good video link. The HLA studies point to African influence and admixture going back to Ancient Egyptian times. The primary influence they say is with Ethiopians. DO you have anything on Ethiopians in Greece and also Africans in Greece in Ottoman times? Of note again, the study never claimed ALL Greeks are admixed..
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Post by herodotus on Feb 2, 2014 14:26:16 GMT -5
the pic is from the artist imagination, as regards the actual skin color understand that the above falls well within the range of modern Europeans,he was more likely much much darker than the above
Indeed, possibly quite dark-skinned. The mutation for blue eyes HERC2 (OCA2) occurred outside of Africa. Look at the map above. It is not African. The mutation for blue eyes occurred in Europe or on the outskirts (Black Sea). www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-511473/All-blue-eyed-people-traced-ancestor-lived-10-000-years-ago-near-Black-Sea.htmlThe 3 individuals you posted with blue eyes share that European/Black Sea ancestor 8,000 years ago. This ancestor if alive today would be called "White" as far as the social construct goes, not "Black".
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Post by herodotus on Feb 2, 2014 14:29:04 GMT -5
Blue eyes are a marker of non-African ancestry. The mutation arose outside Africa.
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Post by herodotus on Feb 2, 2014 14:32:52 GMT -5
Not all mutations are African. Please try to grow up. This "africans have all features" is tiresome.
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Post by truthteacher2007 on Feb 2, 2014 19:52:11 GMT -5
Good video link. The HLA studies point to African influence and admixture going back to Ancient Egyptian times. The primary influence they say is with Ethiopians. DO you have anything on Ethiopians in Greece and also Africans in Greece in Ottoman times? Of note again, the study never claimed ALL Greeks are admixed.. I haven't found any documentaries or articles that mention mainland Greece specifically. However, it must be remembered that Greece was not an independent nation, but a territory of the Ottoman Empire. Therefore, if they were in Creete and Cyprus, I'm sure they would have been in other Greek speaking areas as well. As far as where the Africans came from, Eithiopia would be the primary location since at that time it would have been the primary point of origin for African slaves.
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Post by eternalsky on Feb 8, 2014 22:06:12 GMT -5
Blue eyes are a marker of non-African ancestry. The mutation arose outside Africa. This is only partially true. Although most of the time, blue eyes are a feature that can be traced back to the Balkan peninsula and has no direct roots in Africa, many African people (as well as other non-white people) can obtain blue eyes either via ocular albinism or some similar eye depigmentation mutation.
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Post by zarahan on Feb 17, 2014 0:26:27 GMT -5
Geneticist L. Fox is quoted in the article as sayng: "The biggest surprise was to discover that this individual possessed African versions in the genes that determine the light pigmentation of the current Europeans," Carles Lalueza-Fox, a researcher from the Spanish National Research Council, said in a press release accompanying the findings.There are African versions of the genes that determined light pigmentation in the ancient European specimen. Very interesting. They also say that only Africans today have that combination of dark skin and blue eyes. "One surprise is that the La Braña man had dark skin and blue eyes, a combination rarely seen in modern Europeans."news.sciencemag.org/archaeology/2014/01/how-farming-reshaped-our-genomesAlso interesting. PEr article www.ibtimes.com/7000-year-old-man-had-dark-skin-blue-eyes-dna-la-brana-1-taken-ancient-tooth-photo-1548617 7,000-Year-Old Man Had Dark Skin And Blue Eyes; DNA From ‘La Braña 1’ Taken From Ancient Tooth [PHOTO] By Zoe Mintz on January 27 2014 11:49 AM la brana La Braña 1, the name used to baptize a 7,000-year-old individual from the Mesolithic Period, had blue eyes and dark skin. CSIC
The remains of a 7,000-year-old man have shed light on how ancient European hunter-gatherers may have looked.
Dubbed La Braña 1, the remains recovered at the La Braña-Arintero archeological site in Valdelugueros, Spain, included a wisdom tooth. DNA taken from the tooth suggests he had blue eyes, dark hair and dark skin. The findings, published in the journal Nature, also suggest that light skin developed not just because of Europe's relatively low-light conditions, but also due to hunter-gatherers' diet and environment.
"Before we started this work, I had some ideas of what we were going to find," Carles Lalueza-Fox, who led the study at the Institute of Evolutionary Biology in Barcelona, told the Guardian. "Most of those ideas turned out to be completely wrong."
Many scientists have supported the theory that lighter skin in Europeans developed approximately 40,000 years ago after humans migrated from tropical Africa. The latest discovery suggests this adaptation took longer than previously thought and instead occurred just 7,000 years ago.
"It was assumed that the lighter skin was something needed in high latitudes to synthesize vitamin D in places where UV light is lower than in the tropics," Lalueza-Fox told LiveScience.
Instead, the findings suggest that light skin was not wholly developed due to high latitudes, because that adaptation would have taken place thousands of years earlier, Lalueza-Fox said.
Besides skin color, the eye color suggested by the hunter-gatherer's DNA came as another surprise, since the mutation that causes blue eyes was thought to have developed earlier than the mutation that affects light skin color.
"Even more surprising was to find that he possessed the genetic variations that produce blue eyes in current Europeans, resulting in a unique phenotype in a genome that is otherwise clearly northern European," Lalueza-Fox said.
La Braña 1 was first discovered in 2006 when a group of cavers found two skeletons in the Cantabrian Mountains of northwest Spain. The cave’s cool environment preserved the remains of two men believed to be in their early thirties. Using the better-preserved of the two skeletons, scientists made several attempts before successfully reconstructing the man’s genome.
The researchers say their next attempt will be to perform the same task on the lesser-preserved skeleton, La Braña 2, in hopes of gaining a better understanding of early Europeans.
The findings also suggest that La Braña 1 may be a common ancestor of a 24,000-year-old boy found at Mal’ta near Lake Baikal in eastern Siberia. The boy’s DNA indicates he most likely had brown hair, brown eyes and freckled skin.
"These data indicate that there is genetic continuity in the populations of central and western Eurasia. In fact, these data are consistent with other archeological remains, similar to those found in excavations in Europe and Russia, including the site of Mal'ta, where anthropomorphic figures called Paleolithic Venus have been recovered, and they are very similar to each other," Lalueza-Fox says. "
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