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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2016 8:31:42 GMT -5
Since ancient northern Egyptians were on average light brown skinned, Afrocentrists respond light brown skin shades are found at more southern latitudes. However, what they ignore is the frequency is very low. There is no population from tropical latitude or sub-saharan Africa which on average is light brown skinned.
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Post by meruh on Apr 19, 2016 0:03:08 GMT -5
There are light brown skin people in Sub-Saharan Africa. Two good examples are the San people of South Africa (the oldest native group) and in East Africa many Ethiopians are light brown skinned.
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Post by Ish Gebor on Apr 19, 2016 7:05:19 GMT -5
--Lamason et al. 2005; Norton et al. 2007 --Soejima M, Koda Y, Population differences of two coding SNPs in pigmentation-related genes SLC24A5 and SLC45A2. Int. J. Legal Med. 2007 Jan; 121(1):36-9. Institution Department of Forensic Medicine and Human Genetics, Kurume University School of Medicine, Kurume, 830-0011, Japan.
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Post by Ish Gebor on Apr 19, 2016 7:08:59 GMT -5
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Post by Ish Gebor on Apr 19, 2016 7:21:24 GMT -5
Since ancient northern Egyptians were on average light brown skinned, Afrocentrists respond light brown skin shades are found at more southern latitudes. However, what they ignore is the frequency is very low. There is no population from tropical latitude or sub-saharan Africa which on average is light brown skinned.
"Since ancient northern Egyptians were on average light brown skinned": What do you consider light brown skinned, since it's relative? And why the segregation?
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Post by Ish Gebor on Apr 19, 2016 7:24:37 GMT -5
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Post by zarahan on Apr 20, 2016 15:07:14 GMT -5
Excellent info Gabor. Can;t add much more but just looking at the OP it is laughable with even cursory examination. The dummy Anglo (he keeps using new screen names and spamming the same arguments) is easily debunked by any informed reader who can see the bogus nature of the claim below: Since ancient northern Egyptians were on average light brown skinned, Afrocentrists respond light brown skin shades are found at more southern latitudes. However, what they ignore is the frequency is very low. There is no population from tropical latitude or sub-saharan Africa which on average is light brown skinned.Complete rubbish- and easily debunked- more so with Patrol's data but even a few points below suffice.. 1) Simply being in the north of Egypt does not preclude people from having dark brown to jet black skin. NEWSFLASH: The Egyptians like other Africans moved around! They came from the north into the south to start the dynastic era for example. Who says they were sitting around waiting for mystical "Caucasoids" from someplace to give them skin color "diversity"? 2) Africans have the most skin color diversity BUILT-IN as the homeland of anatomically modern humans. There was always plenty of dark brown skin downriver towards the Medit. 3) Low frequencies of pale skin in SOME parts of Africa don't mean anything for most Egyptians did not have pale skin, and in any event the quantity of brown skin in Africa is more than enough to cover Egypt and North Africa without needing any "wandering Caucasoids." As can be seen from the skin colormap below- there is plenty of skin color variation to go around NATIVE to Africa. 4) Egyptian conventions in art often painted skin artificial colors - yellowish for women and red for men. The true color under the fierce desert sun is not always in evidence. So the so-called "light skin Egyptian" talking point doesn't mean much in context. Under Egypt’s fierce sun, however, few persons would have remained pale-faced; therefore the representation of skin color may have been more symbolic than accurate. Among several values, red had connotations of vitality while yellow suggested immortality and perhaps beauty.”Anne K. Capel, Mistress of the House, Mistress of Heaven: Women in Ancient Egypt ^^Light skin West Africans ^^Yet more sub-Saharan Africans with light brown skin Just as narrow noses are nothing special in Africa, neither is light skin- from yellowish hues of the San to the light brown "redbones" of the so-called 'Red Igbo" of West Africa. ------------------------------------------------- And speaking of light skin, EUropean "role models" only turned white recently..
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Post by zarahan on Apr 20, 2016 16:29:41 GMT -5
Your weak strawman fails completely. For one thing no credible "Afrocentric" goes around saying all sub-Saharans, or even most have light brown skin. Diop didn't, nor Asante nor any other of the heavyweights, nor do knowledgeable people on the web. This a completely bogus strawman. But in any event, the attempt to contradict fake "Afrocentric" strawman fails and only confirms our data. Note in the chart below there are also "Bantu" groups with light skin diversity, as expected in a diverse Africa. AFRICAN SKIN COLOR DIVERSITY: One of the biggest groups in Nigeria, the Ngwa people, have skin color ranges in the lighter shades at almost 20%. The Ngwa of southern Nigeria are not a small group at all but one of the biggest in Nigeria. The Ngwa, an Igbo group, constitute the largest and most populous sub-ethnicity, or clan, in southeastern Nigeria.[1] They occupy an area of about 1,328 square kilometres (513 sq mi),[2] although some accounts read at least 2,300 km2 (900 square miles).[3] In 1979, their population was held at an estimate of approximately 1.5 million people.[ Oluikpe Benson, O.A. (1979) Igbo Transformational Syntax: An Ngwa Dialect Example]
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Post by djoser-xyyman on Apr 21, 2016 4:41:27 GMT -5
!Kung
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Post by djoser-xyyman on Apr 21, 2016 4:44:14 GMT -5
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Post by djoser-xyyman on Apr 21, 2016 4:49:53 GMT -5
I am curious about the Ngwa and their location in South "EAST" Africa. Are they huntergatherers like the Khoi? They have an extremely high frequency of light skin.
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Post by Ish Gebor on Apr 21, 2016 6:57:43 GMT -5
I am curious about the Ngwa and their location in South "EAST" Africa. Are they huntergatherers like the Khoi? They have an extremely high frequency of light skin. Both extremes have a mediterranean African climate. South Africa:
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Post by Tukuler al~Takruri on Apr 21, 2016 13:34:19 GMT -5
The people(s) responsible for the sweep of light skin across S Europe ~4000 BCE likely were lighter brown.
They were not the same people N Europe got its light skins. They had it 7.7kya per the Motala Sweden remains.
This is in keeping with Posche's proposed origin of Nordheimers as followed up by Finch, Kittles, and Westerhof.
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Post by zarahan on Apr 21, 2016 18:56:07 GMT -5
I am curious about the Ngwa and their location in South "EAST" Africa. Are they huntergatherers like the Khoi? They have an extremely high frequency of light skin. The Ngwa in question, at least those in chart above, are from West Africa- a sub-group of the Igbo. This tracks with documentary evidence from West Africans who show such "native redbones" were long in place BEFORE any white people or Arabs showed up. This should not be surprising in ultra diverse Africa. Famous slave ship escapee Equiano talked about these people before he was taken from his homeland, and he could speak about the difference between them and the white European slavers on the ships. I am not sure if a similar sounding name is found among the San. And you are right on the Medit climate tht would play a part in some areas. But its not only climate- which some use to try to say would make such skin impossible outside coastal Medit type zones. With their built-in native diversity Africans would have the diversity even without any climatic factor. "Badsen [GT Badsen, "Niger Ibos," Frank Cass and Co, London, 1938: 123-124], in his early-twentieth century study of the physical appearance of the Igbo, had this to say: 'On the whole, the Ibos are of good physique and compare favorably with other African tribes.. Many Ibos are truly as black as the proverbial coal: others are almost as light-skinned as the natives of Southern Europe, while a few are distinctly reddish. The folk who stand out obtrusively are the albinos.'" --Gloria Chuku (2013) The Igbo Intellectual Tradition. pp 48-49 QUOTE: "He disengaged himself from other life experiences and went back to a particular spot in his memory to capture the racial distinctions he was able to make. He saw no distinction in skin color between the red men in Igboland and the white men he met on the slave ship. "--Jacob Korieh. 2009. Olaudah Equiano and the Igbo world: history, society and Atlantic. 2009 " Oye-Eboe" may be a version of the Igbo word oyibo used in the nineteenth century to mean "white man," Equiano clearly uses it to refer to other Africans, perhaps the Aro slave traders. At this point in is life, he tells us, he had not yet seen or even heard of a European." -- Vincent Carretta. 2005. Equiano, the African: biography of a self-made man. p15
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