Hidden West African-Kemetian connection

[clouddesignc7]

Originally posted by Whatbox:

Ok. So we know of the various connections they had proto-Dynastic era with the Horn and East Africa in general. There is ample evidence (even an Egyptian artifact i believe) of what is now the Ethiopian region's connection and ancient Ethiopia had a prehistoric-Neolithic presence in the entire Eastern Saharan region. There are connections with Kemet to Eritrea, and they claimed in their own language they were from the land of Pwanit, likely located in the Eritrean-North Ethiopian region. There are also connections to Southern Sudan. So we have them as being a Nile Valley influenced civilization with Horn / Afrisan influences coming from the Eastern coast as well.

What I quote (also by whatbox) about the Sahara below is based off of the fact that it DID NOT EXIST in pre-pharaohnic times, in the "Mesolithic" times right before Ancient Egypt was started.

This is big, I repeat, the Sahara desert as a barrier DID NOT EXIST in those pre-pharaohnic times.

(So the Sahara desert as a barrier didn't exist; there were no "sub-Saharan Africans" because sub-Saharan Africans (and animals) (from south of the Sahara) roamed all over Africa. There were just Africans. Notice the giraffe in the Cave painting from Egypt by the way.)

More and more so i wondered about the regions to their East and West also. With the previously nonexistent wetlands and plentiful game we see in the North African Mesolithic and with Each section - West, East, and "Mesopotamia" (two rivers) having two - having its major rivers it can suggest that major East or Westward migrations had little incentive behind them. Nevertheless, East Africa's population did end up migrating Northward and Eastward so expanding population pressure has to be factored in. And the entire region from Niger Egypt saw the same transition from hyper arid to wet and rainy back to desert again. And what of the Fertile crescent? Did it share in the same climatic transitions or did the Northward moving rainfall belts stay African? These climatic transitions - the hyper arid phase, mesolithic wet phase where the Sahara retreats North and disappears, and the re-emergence and Southward Spread of the Sahara we know today - seemed to have coincided with the dawn of the Neolithic for all these areas and eventual rise of Nation-level civilization (first known one was in the Nile Valley -- "Ancient Egypt"). These are all questions this thread over the next few posts aims to clear up.

[clouddesignc7]

People from far SOUTH roamed far to the NORTH in what are now Arab-Berber areas

Originally posted by Whatbox:
[QB]

Originally posted by dana marniche:
[qb] For all you focusing on genetics out there. I was wondering what if anything has been said about the relationship of the Bantu -speakers with more robust popoulations of ancient Egypt and Nubia (pre Badarian) as at Jebel Sahaba and Wadi Halfa. The latter had not undergone the gracilization the later inhabitants had, i.e. Badarians, Naqqada etc.

I have had a theory for some time now that these earlier more "robust" people may have been represented by some of the Bantu speakers.

Medjay [/qb]

The Medjay you pictured indeed, as do most sculpted figurines, have detailed facial profiles. The Medjay are supposed to be ancestors or related to ancestors of the modern Beja of the Eastern desert.

And your question of ancient egyptian appearing as a gracile-robust Nile and Western mix looking mix is interesting -- especially when you bring up the Teita, who have oft been mentioned by anthropologists as a deep South Eastern African group resembling Nile Valley inhabitants and ancient Egyptians in particular. Although, these resemblances could have been there before the Bantu.

The migrations of what are known today as Bantu speakers start when Kemetic civilization ends, not begins, and seem to have had two radiation epicenters -- Nigerian and Cameroonian regions i believe. There have been some interesting lingual comparisons though.

There were two ancient major migratory events that shape the way 90% of Africa is today other than the Bantu spreading pretty much throughout Southern Africa: a.) the Northward ones starting in South East Africa which became buttressed by Northward shifting rainfall belts and disappearance of a prior-to-then hyper-arid Sahara taking place place several millennium before the Pharaohnic Dynastic-era Kemetic Nation was founded and b.) the Southward one following the Sahara's re-desertification which sparked the dawn of the just-mentioned age of the pharaohs. The second, b), back migration is believed to have affected East Africa and the Horn of Africa, as genetics seems to say these regions have a lot of genes from Nubia but this seems to be no different than the rest of the Pharaohs frequented world they were in contact with and is even like this with speakers of Nilo-Saharan languages. I suspect the back-migration theory so accepted and so pushed for East Africa is also true for West Africa.

Algeria, Sefar Tassili n'Ajjer ancient rock art in the Sahara:



South, modern Mali





By the way, the aforesaid genes i write as "Nubian" are dubbed so on the fly here by me because the consensus is that their origins lay in the bottleneck that would have took place at the human refugiums near lake Nubia in Sudan during a hyper arid phase. This phase by the way preceded the Wet phase where the Nile was flooded and the Delta, and coastal North Africa beyond flooded were submerged swampland -- even in Dynastic times few inhabited these areas. Back to what i was going to say on the Nubian genes - and i'm talking about E1 -M78 and -M35 bytheway - these themselves derived from E1b1b* itself likely originating between The Horn and Tanzania, perhaps in population(s) directly ancestral to the Borana of Kenya. In other words this originates deeper South and i guess what happened was the highway that was re-opened and extended to all the Nile a few millenia before Dynastic Age Kemetian civ.

Ok but to definitively answer and address your question: if you're looking for a Western connection look no further than the groups in the Western Sahel today. Their ancestors built complexes with Kings and practices on par with Kemet that date to a similar time phrame, 4,000 years B.C.E. I figure the desert's trek back South slowed them down behind Kemet -- or perhaps it caused their emergence and transition from being happy game chasers in the paradise of sorts.

Moreover findings like those in Tassili n'Ajjer point to knowledge in astronomy, something there's a buzz about over the Dogon having (it was known Egyptians had such knowledge, but unexpected of the Dogon despite the clear skies these people must have lived under before all this shi- started being dumped in the air). The is Saharan rock art that depicts practices similar to what we find in the Western Sahel today. The Fulani's ancestors may have lived in an ancient Algerian region for instance. It's already accepted on the Eastern African end that the Sahara's re-emergence and trek back South caused some people and genes to move back South too (resources). Why not on the Western, in which there was no Northward flowing river but only that to the South (the Niger Valley), after the grasslands, forests, rivers and lakes all disappeared and turned to desert?

There's your West African connection though. One interesting Eastern (Libyan i believe) Saharan finding was Uan Muhuggiag, dubbed "the Black Mummy" which makes me wonder how exceptionally black he looked to be given such a title. You have to wonder how ancient Egyptian PHARAOHS got Benin sickle cell -- unless they had some kind now extinct it was the Benin variant, which their spread would explain its spread all over Greece, in Italy, and south-Western Asia in general.

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[clouddesignc7]

More art from the Sahara

Originally posted by Whatbox:
[QB]

[clouddesignc7]

Originally posted by Whatbox:

Here are citations paying homage to some of the stuff i've talked about:

[*]On West - East connections:

Ray A. Kea, and Mauny, R. (1971), “The Western Sudan” in Shinnie: 66-87.

Monteil, Charles (1953), “La Légende du Ouagadou et l’Origine des Soninke” in Mélanges Ethnologiques (Dakar: Bulletin del’Institut Francais del’Afrique Noir)



"Before 2000 BC, what is today the southern Sahara was inhabited by significant numbers of herders and farmers. On the rocky promontories of the Tichitt-Walata (Birou) and Tagant Plateaus in modern day Mauritania, they built what are considered among the earliest known civilizations in western Africa. Composed of more than 400 stone masonry settlements, with clear street layouts, some settlements had massive surrounding walls while others were less fortified. In a deteriorating environment, where arable land and pasturage were at a premium, the population grew and relatively large-scale political organizations emerged - factors which no doubt explain the homogeneity of architecture, settlement patterns, and material culture (e.g., lithic and ceramic traditions). This agro-pastoral society traded in jewelry and semi-precious stones from distant parts of the Sahara and Sahel, while crafts, hunting, and fishing were also important economic pursuits...Their elites built funerary monuments for themselves over a period extending from 4000 to 1000 BC."

Rock Artists [link]

[clouddesignc7]

Originally posted by Whatbox:

"Examination of certain rock paintings in the Tassili-N'Ajjer suggests the presence of proto-Fulani cultural traits in the region by at least the fourth millennium B.C. Tassili-N'Ajjer in Algeria is one of the most famous North African sites of rock painting. Scholars specializing in Fulani culture believe that some of the imagery depicts rituals that are still practiced by contemporary Fulani people.

At the Tin Tazarift site, for instance, historian Amadou Hampate Ba recognized a scene of the lotori ceremony, a celebration of the ox's aquatic origin. In a finger motif, Ba detected an allusion to the myth of the hand of the first Fulani herdsman, Kikala. At Tin Felki, Ba recognized a hexagonal carnelian jewel as related to the Agades cross, a fertility charm still used by Fulani women."

[*]On Northward Rainfall and Southward desertificatory migrations:

Vincenza Battaglia et. al. 2009, Y-chromosomal evidence of the cultural diffusion of
agriculture in southeast Europe

references this text:

Kuper R, Kro¨pelin S: Climate-controlled Holocene occupationin the Sahara: motor of Africa’s evolution. Science 2006; 313: 803 – 807.

"A recent archaeological study reveals
that during a desiccation period in North Africa, while the
eastern Sahara was depopulated, a refugium existed on the
border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia,
until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC
(radiocarbon-calibrated date). The rapid arrival of wet
conditions during this Early Holocene period provided an
impetus for population movement into habitat that was
quickly settled afterwards. Hg E-M78* representatives,although rare overall, still occur in Egypt, which is a hub
for the distribution of the various geographically localized
M78-related sub-clades. The northward-moving rainfallbelts during this period could have also spurred a rapid
migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the
Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe,
where they each eventually differentiated into their
regionally distinctive branches."

On this same M78:

Hassan et. al. 2008, Y-Chromosome Variation Among Sudanese: Restricted Gene Flow, Concordance With Language, Geography, and History

"Although this haplogroup is common to most Sudanese populations, it has exceptionally high frequency among populations like those of western Sudan (particularly Darfur) and the Beja in eastern Sudan.

Sudden climate change
might have forced several Neolithic cultures/people to
shift northwards to the Mediterranean and southwards
to the Sahel"

Egypt and Sub-Saharan Africa: Their Interaction, Encyclopedia of Precolonial Africa, by Joseph O. Vogel, AltaMira Press, Walnut Creek, California (1997), pp. 465-472

"The period when sub-Saharan Africa was most influential in Egypt was a time when neither Egypt, as we understand it culturally, nor the Sahara, as we understand it geographically, existed. Populations and cultures now found south of the desert roamed far to the north. The culture of Upper Egypt, which became dynastic Egyptian civilization, could fairly be called a Sudanese transplant. Egypt rapidly found a method of disciplining the river, the land, and the people to transform the country into a titanic garden. Egypt rapidly developed detailed cultural forms that dwarfed its forebears in urbanity and elaboration. Thus, when new details arrived, they were rapidly adapted to the vast cultural superstructure already present. On the other hand, pharaonic culture was so bound to its place near the Nile that its huge, interlocked religious, administrative, and formal structures could not be readily transferred to relatively mobile cultures of the desert, savanna, and forest. The influence of the mature pharaonic civilizations of Egypt and Kush was almost confined to their sophisticated trade goods and some significant elements of technology. Nevertheless, the religious substratum of Egypt and Kush was so similar to that of many cultures in southern Sudan today that it remains possible that fundamental elements derived from the two high cultures to the north live on."

[*]On Kemetian civilization being more than strictly Nile oriented

On Nabta:

[Source]

"This sub-Saharan culture is likely to be the predecessor of the Egyptians."

Late Neolithic megalithic structures at Nabta Playa

"The discoveries at Nabta Playa suggest the possibility of a previously unrecognized relationship between the Neolithic people living along the Nile and pastoralists in the adjacent Sahara which may have contributed to the rise of social complexity in ancient Egypt. This complexity, as expressed by different levels of authority within the society, forms the basis for the structure of both the Neolithic society at Nabta and the Old Kingdom of Egypt. It was this authority at Nabta which made possible the planned arrangement of their villages, the excavation of large, deep wells, and the construction of complex stone structures made of large, shaped and unshaped stones. There are other Nabta features which are shared by the two areas, but which appear suddenly and without evident local antecedents in the late Predynastic and early Old Kingdom in the Nile Valley. These include the role of cattle to express differences of wealth, power and authority, the emphasis on cattle in religious beliefs, and the use of astronomical knowledge and devices to predict solar events. Many of these features have a prior and long history of development at Nabta."

Genesis of the Pharaohs: Genesis of the ‘Ka’ and Crowns?

"In his Genesis of the Pharaohs, Toby Wilkinson shines new light on the Predynastic by demonstrating that the majority of rock drawings in the Eastern Desert of Upper Egypt date to Naqada I (c. 4000–3500 BC). Since the petroglyphs depict wild African fauna, hunters with bows and dogs, and men herding cattle, it is clear that the now nearly lifeless region up to 100 km east of the Nile between Quft and Hierakonpolis was at this time a well-watered, well-populated, game-rich savanna. That the rock artists were not mere isolated pastoralists but also part-time Nile dwellers is evident because their works commonly include boats. This implies that the artists probably moved from river to range in seasonal cycles. Because of this, and the fact that so many of the drawings echo subjects in later Egyptian art, Wilkinson makes a compelling case that the rock artists were the ancestors of the dynastic Egyptians. His conclusion: “the heavy reliance of these people on herding and hunting rather than agriculture suggests that their roots — and indeed the roots of Egyptian civilization — lay not so much along the Nile but in the pre-arid Sahara.”"

Christopher Ehret
Professor of History, African Studies Chair
University of California at Los Angeles

"Ancient Egyptian civilization was, in ways and to an extent usually not recognized, fundamentally African. The evidence of both language and culture reveals these African roots.

The origins of Egyptian ethnicity lay in the areas south of Egypt. The ancient Egyptian language belonged to the Afrasian family (also called Afroasiatic or, formerly, Hamito-Semitic). The speakers of the earliest Afrasian languages, according to recent studies, were a set of peoples whose lands between 15,000 and 13,000 B.C. stretched from Nubia in the west to far northern Somalia in the east. They supported themselves by gathering wild grains. The first elements of Egyptian culture were laid down two thousand years later, between 12,000 and 10,000 B.C., when some of these Afrasian communities expanded northward into Egypt, bringing with them a language directly ancestral to ancient Egyptian. They also introduced to Egypt the idea of using wild grains as food.

A new religion came with them as well. Its central tenet explains the often localized origins of later Egyptian gods: the earliest Afrasians were, properly speaking, neither monotheistic nor polytheistic. Instead, each local community, comprising a clan or a group of related clans, had its own distinct deity and centered its religious observances on that deity. This belief system persists today among several Afrasian peoples of far southwest Ethiopia. And as Biblical scholars have shown, Yahweh, god of the ancient Hebrews, an Afrasian people of the Semitic group, was originally also such a deity. The connection of many of Egypt's predynastic gods to particular localities is surely a modified version of this early Afrasian belief. Political unification in the late fourth millennium brought the Egyptian deities together in a new polytheistic system. But their local origins remain amply apparent in the records that have come down to us.

During the long era between about 10,000 and 6000 B.C., new kinds of southern influences diffused into Egypt. During these millennia, the Sahara had a wetter climate than it has today, with grassland or steppes in many areas that are now almost absolute desert. New wild animals, most notably the cow, spread widely in the eastern Sahara in this period."

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[clouddesignc7]

Here's a link:

www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=007197;p=1#000000

[clouddesignc7]

E3a / E1b1a / E-M2 found in Egypt!!! and the Middle East (and found to be ancient in Egypt):

This first study is Mitochondrial (that's mtDNA) and doesn't mention M2, it just serves as a prelude to what follows:

Global male inputs from Sub-Saharan Africa and Asia across Iran, not the Levant, into the Arabian Peninsula have been estimated in this study, as 13.4% and 16.6% from both source areas respectively. Recent mtDNA studies on the same Arabian Peninsula countries [7-9,12] have confirmed a notable female-driven sub-Saharan African input with a mean value around 15% for all the Peninsula, although frequencies as high as 60% have been detected in Hadramawt populations of Yemen [9]. Curiously, the Iranian female flow (18%) was also rather similar to that calculated for Africa. Although a slight ratio excess of Sub-Saharan African female versus male gene flow is detected (1.12) we do not found the strong sexual bias proposed by other authors for Arabian populations and attributed to the peculiarities of the recent slave-trade [12,36]. Without dismissing the role mediated by slavery, the geographical distribution of these sub-Saharan African lineages in the Arabian Peninsula seems to indicate a prehistoric entrance of a noticeable portion of these lineages that participated in the building of the primitive Arabian population [8,9].

- Khaled K Abu Amero et. al. 2009, Saudi Arabian Y-Chromosome diversity and its relationship with nearby regions[/color]

***

Thoughts about the comedic effect politics may play in all these studies aside:

Them saying that a portion of this African gene-flow, even being maternal, is prehistoric and not due to the recent African slave trade is significant, because as interesting as that would be, they're not the only ones to say so.

Another study suggests the same, only for paternal lineages:

Y-chromosome diversity characterizes the Gulf of Oman
Alicia M Cadenas1, Lev A Zhivotovsky2, Luca L Cavalli-Sforza3, Peter A Underhill3 and Rene J Herrera1
1Department of Biological Sciences, Florida International University, Miami, FL, USA
2N. I. Vavilov Institute of General Genetics, Russian Academy of Sciences, Moscow, Russia
3Department of Genetics, Stanford University, Stanford, CA, USA
Correspondence: Dr RJ Herrera, Department of Biological Sciences, Florida International University, University Park, OE 304, Miami, FL 33199 USA. Tel: [phone]; Fax: [phone]; E-mail: [e-mail]
Received 20 February 2007; Revised 30 August 2007; Accepted 11 September 2007; Published online 10 October 2007.

"Distribution of E3b1-M35 derivatives

The presence of signature sub-Saharan African mtDNA lineages in the south Arabian populations has been attributed to various waves of gene flow to the region, including that associated with the East African slave trade. This is apparent from the exact mtDNA haplotype matches between lineages in Yemen and East Africa, including those associated with the Bantu expansion.20 The presence of the E3a-M2 lineage in Oman (7.4%),4 Yemen (3.2%), UAE (5.5%) and Qatar (2.8%) could lead to the oversimplified conclusion that these chromosomes are also a contribution from the East African slave trade. Mitochondrial DNA analysis of the Yemen Hadramawt indicates recent gene flow (2500 yBP) from Africa to the Arab populations in part through the slave trade, yet an ancient arrival from East Africa is responsible for the Y-chromosome haplotypes."

It is also worthy to note that even not all of the recent genetic contribution to the Middle East would have been via slaves. Poor African migrants (and for that matter, any poor people today) may be .. subjugated in the Middle East today (take poor Indian workers in Dubai for instance), but historically this is a major oversimplification.

On Egyptian E1b1a (M2) aka Lucotte's "haplogroup 4":

Haplotype IV, designating the M2/PN1 subclade, as noted, is found in high frequency in west, central, and sub-equatorial Africa in speakers of Niger-Congo—which may have a special relationship with Nilosaharan—spoken by Nubians; together they might form a superphylum called Kongo-Saharan or Niger-Saharan (see Gregersen 1972, Blench 1995), but this is not fully supported. The spatial distribution of p49a,f TaqI haplotypes in the geographically-widespread speakers of Nilosaharan languages has not been fully characterized, but the notable presence of haplotype IV in Nubians speaking the Eastern Sudanic branch is interesting in that this subgroup is in the Sahelian branch of speakers, whose ancestors may have participated in the domestication of cattle in the eastern Sahara (Ehret 2000, Wendorf and Schild 2001). Sometimes haplotype IV (and the M2 lineage) is seen as being associated with the “Bantu expansion” (2000-3000 bp), but this does not mean that it is not much older, since expansion and origin times cannot be conflated. Haplotype IV has substantial frequencies in upper Egypt and Nubia, greater than VII and VIII, and even V. Bantu languages were never spoken in these regions or Senegal, where M2 is greater than 90 percent in some studies.

- Keita, 2005.

These genes may not be fully expounded upon or characterized, at least not in any studies I'm aware of, *however*, something else has that has been traced back to West Africa: sickle cell disease.

***

Sickle Cell Anemia in the Middle East and Proximate / Other Regions:

The Benin haplotype accounts for HbS associated chromosomes in Sicily,4 Northern Greece,10 Southern Turkey,11 and South West Saudi Arabia,6,7 suggesting that these genes had their origin in West Africa. The Asian haplotype is rarely encountered outside its geographic origin because there have been few large population movements and Indian emigrants have been predominantly from non HbS containing populations. However, it is of interest that the Asian haplotype was first described among descendants of Indian indentured laborers in Jamaica.12

...

From these original foci of the HbS mutation, the gene spread along trading routes to North Africa and the Mediterranean, was transported in large populations to North and South America and the Caribbean during the slave trade, and latterly has spread to Northern Europe by immigration from the Caribbean, directly from Africa to the United Kingdom, France, Belgium, and Holland, and from Turkey to Germany. The relative prevalence of these haplotypes in the Americas reflects the different origins of their African peoples, approximately 70% of HbS associated chromosomes having the Benin haplotype, 10% Senegal and 10% Bantu. Haplotype frequencies in Jamaica are similar to the USA but the Bantu haplotype accounts for the majority of HbS associated chromosomes in Brazil.9

- Graham R. Serjeant, MD, FRCP, MRC Laboratories (Jamaica), University of the West Indies, Kingston.

A good map:

A study on the various types (including Indo-Arabian) in the Middle East (we'll get to how ancient they are after this):

Haplotypes of the beta-globin gene as prognostic factors in sickle-cell disease.

el-Hazmi MA, Warsy AS, Bashir N, Beshlawi A, Hussain IR, Temtamy S, Qubaili F.Medical

Biochemistry Department, World Health Organization Collaborating Centre for Haemoglobinopathies, Thalassaemias and Enzymopathies, College of Medicine, King Khalid University Hospital, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.

The Benin haplotype was found in patients with SEVERE disease, either as homozygous or in combination with another haplotype. The majority of Syrians and Jordanians had the Benin haplotype, and severe disease. However, one in three Syrians and one in five Jordanians had a MILDER disease, and the Saudi-Indian haplotype was identified.

All Saudi patients from south-western and north-western areas, where the disease is generally severe, had the Benin haplotype in the homozygous or heterozygous state. Of the Saudi patients from the eastern area, where a mild form of SCD exists, only 9% had the Benin haplotype. The remainder had the Saudi-Indian haplotype, either in its homozygous or heterozygous state…

Restriction endonuclease restriction sites have provided a useful insight into the normal polymorphic variations in the DNA surrounding various gene loci, where a combination of two or more polymorphic sites has led to the identification of specific haplotype patterns [13,14]. This has been of significance in the study of the regions surrounding the b-globin gene (i.e. the b-globin gene cluster), where several polymorphic sites have been identified, and population differences have been found on analysis of the haplotype pattern [9]. An interesting observation is that the sickle-cell mutation has occurred on chromosomes carrying different polymorphic sites and different b-globin gene haplotypes, and this seems to play a role in the clinical expression of SCD [9].

We compared the haplotype pattern of SCD patients from different Arabic-speaking countries. Benin haplotype was the major haplotype in all countries with a SEVERE presentation of SCD and it was present in both the homozygous and heterozygous state. This was true for those SCD patients from south-western and north-western areas of Saudi Arabia, and for those from Egypt, Jordan and Syrian Arab Republic. On the other hand, patients from the eastern part of Saudi Arabia, who present with a significantly milder clinical picture, carried the Saudi-Indian b-globin gene haplotype either in its homozygous or heterozygous state."

- 1999, Eastern Mediterranean Health Journal

Modern Middle Easterners would not be the only ones to have severe anemia, PreDynastic Egyptian mummies have it too:

Use of the amplification refractory mutation system (ARMS) in the study of HbS in predynastic Egyptian remains.
Dipartimento di Biologia Animale e dell'Uomo, Università degli Studi di Torino.

PMID: 11148985 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

We conducted a molecular investigation of the presence of sicklemia in six predynastic Egyptian mummies (about 3200 BC) from the Anthropological and Ethnographic Museum of Turin. Previous studies of these remains showed the presence of SEVERE anemia, while histological preparations of mummified tissues revealed hemolytic disorders. DNA was extracted from dental samples with a silica-gel method specific for ancient DNA. A modification of the polymerase chain reaction (PCR), called amplification refractory mutation system (ARMS) was then applied. ARMS is based on specific priming of the PCR and it permits diagnosis of single nucleotide mutations. In this method, amplification can occur only in the presence of the specific mutation being studied. The amplified DNA was analyzed by electrophoresis. In samples of three individuals, there was a band at the level of the HbS mutated fragment, indicating that they were affected by sicklemia. On the basis of our results, we discuss the possible uses of new molecular investigation systems in paleopathological diagnoses of genetic diseases and viral, bacterial and fungal infections.

- Massa et. al., 1999

All I have to say to that one is, no wonder! ;D

(No wonder about the previous studies attributing M2's presence not to descent / babies of a slave male Middle Eastern Papa, but to ancients) (and fyi male slave input in Mena / Muslim populations seems to have always been negligable if at all

[clouddesignc7]

A good map:



Notice the Benin sickle cell goes to Egypt and the Middle East.

[clouddesignc7]

Ramses III

Ramses was found to be E-M2 / E3a / E1b1a (West African)!!

"Genetic kinship analyses revealed identical haplotypes in both mummies (table 1); using the Whit Athey's haplogroup predictor, we determined the Y chromosomal haplogroup E1b1a. The testing of polymorphic autosomal microsatellite loci provided similar results in at least one allele of each marker (table 2)."

- Hawass et al 2012. Revisiing the harem conspiracy and death of Ramesses III. British Medical Journal, BMJ2012;345:e8268

[anansi]

Because Your thread is West African specific I wont post this here but this is rather interesting.
African Cultural and Ritual Dances

[clouddesignc7]

E-M2 found at 13.9 percent and at 7.7% in Egypt!

Dec 26, 2010 15:13:47 GMT -5 Dawn2Earth said:

On Egyptian E1b1a (M2) aka Lucotte's "haplogroup 4":

Haplotype IV, designating the M2/PN1 subclade, as noted, is found in high frequency in west, central, and sub-equatorial Africa in speakers of Niger-Congo—which may have a special relationship with Nilosaharan—spoken by Nubians; together they might form a superphylum called Kongo-Saharan or Niger-Saharan (see Gregersen 1972, Blench 1995), but this is not fully supported. The spatial distribution of p49a,f TaqI haplotypes in the geographically-widespread speakers of Nilosaharan languages has not been fully characterized, but the notable presence of haplotype IV in Nubians speaking the Eastern Sudanic branch is interesting in that this subgroup is in the Sahelian branch of speakers, whose ancestors may have participated in the domestication of cattle in the eastern Sahara (Ehret 2000, Wendorf and Schild 2001). Sometimes haplotype IV (and the M2 lineage) is seen as being associated with the “Bantu expansion” (2000-3000 bp), but this does not mean that it is not much older, since expansion and origin times cannot be conflated. Haplotype IV has substantial frequencies in upper Egypt and Nubia, greater than VII and VIII, and even V. Bantu languages were never spoken in these regions or Senegal, where M2 is greater than 90 percent in some studies.

- Keita, 2005.

E-M2 found at 13.9 percent in a sample size of 274 Egyptians and was found at 7.7 percent in a sample size of 52 Egyptians. So E-M2 was found at 13.9 and 7.7 percent.

It was found at 13.9% and 7.7% from that same study:

www.academia.edu/10933902/Genetics_Egypt_and_History_Interpreting_Geographical_Patterns_of_Y_Chromosomal_Variation

Keita, Genetics, Egypt, and History: Interpreting Geographical Patterns of Y Chromosome variation

***

Here's the quote:

Haplotype IV, designating the M2/PN1 subclade, as noted, is found in high frequency in west, central, and sub-equatorial Africa in speakers of Niger-Congo—which may have a special relationship with Nilosaharan—spoken by Nubians; together they might form a superphylum called Kongo-Saharan or Niger-Saharan (see Gregersen 1972, Blench 1995), but this is not fully supported. The spatial distribution of p49a,f TaqI haplotypes in the geographically-widespread speakers of Nilosaharan languages has not been fully characterized, but the notable presence of haplotype IV in Nubians speaking the Eastern Sudanic branch is interesting in that this subgroup is in the Sahelian branch of speakers, whose ancestors may have participated in the domestication of cattle in the eastern Sahara (Ehret 2000, Wendorf and Schild 2001). Sometimes haplotype IV (and the M2 lineage) is seen as being associated with the “Bantu expansion” (2000-3000 bp), but this does not mean that it is not much older, since expansion and origin times cannot be conflated. Haplotype IV has substantial frequencies in upper Egypt and Nubia, greater than VII and VIII, and even V. Bantu languages were never spoken in these regions or Senegal, where M2 is greater than 90 percent in some studies.

[...]

Haplotype IV [was found at] 7.7 percent [in] Egypt [...]

Haplotype IV [was found at] 13.9 percent [in] Egypt

[djoser-xyyman]

Not sure what point you are making by your post?

1. Based Upon RECENT autosomal studies (SNP) modern Egyptians are the MOST admixed with foreign genes than all North Africans. Modern Egyptians are essentially Turks. Sources cited here on ESR. Another main resource have concluded that the invasion of Modern Egypt began about 1300AD(Ottoman invasion). So it was NOT due to invasion from “Arabs” since there is very little difference between indigenous Arabs and some Africans.. Modern Egyptians are heavily admixed with Ottoman Turks. In addition The Amarna’s are essentially sub-saharan Africans based upon autosomal STR. The one male haplogroup that was identified was E-M2 for Rameses III and Man E. Closest genetic match to BOTH Rameses III and Man E …AND the Amarnas were South Africans, Great Lakes Africans and modern West Africans. Modern Levantines and even Magrebians Africans are very distant along with modern Horners.

So I assume the point you are making confirms that yes, Modern Egyptians are essentially foreigners?

Is that the point?

[asante]

Sept 21, 2016 12:19:12 GMT -5 clouddesignc7 said:

A good map:



Notice the Benin sickle cell goes to Egypt and the Middle East.

The issue with that map is that West Africa was not the launching pad of Niger-Congo speakers who characterize the carriers of the adaption. The launching pad was rather the Nile Valley.